⛪️ Church Discipline Taught by Christ Attempt Salvation 🛟 Others to Be Fearful of Sinning 🧯 Obedience to ALL Jesus Commanded 📖 Matt 28:18-20...

[Nochaeld]

Father, we are taught to teach obedience to all that Christ commanded, Matt 28:20: That both Heaven and Hell are Real Places, one is avoided by trusting Jesus and obeying all He Commanded, John 8:10-11, Whether They Listen or Not, Ezek 2:5, Response to Word is What Judges on That Day, Jn 12:48, If Don't Listen to Two or Three Witnesses, Bring before Church, Mt 18:17 -- Church Discipline is Part of The Great Commission (Go and Make Disciples of All Nations, Baptizing Them in The Name of The Father, Son and Holy Spirit, TEACHING Them to Obey EVERYTHING I Have Commanded, Matt 28:19-20... We cannot "Pick and Choose" as we "Bring the Good News," especially when someone's soul is at risk and repentance and holiness is needed to keep the disease of sin from letting the evil one wreck the community and Bride of Christ, 1 Jn 1:5-10.

Did God know the first couple wouldn't listen? Rhetorical question -- of course... Rom 3:5-6... Did He warn Adam anyway? Did Adam warn Eve??? Obviously... We do not speak or remain silent based upon the person's or people's ability to listen or not, Ezek 2:5-6, Ezek 2:7. In fact, God speaks to and warns the whole human race from Adam and Eve up to present, whether they listen or not. Consider first: He did warn Adam and Eve knowing they'd not obey, correct? Yes, for "The Lamb of God was slain before the foundation of the world," Rev 13:8

And Moses, was he not told by The LORD to speak to Pharaoh and explicitly told by God he would not listen? Ex 3:1-4:22. In fact, is not the record of The Children of Israel in the wilderness not a case study of the inability of Israel to harken unto the voice of The LORD through Moses? Deut 13:4. It is repeated in MANY Psalms and by Stephen at his defense and martyrdom, Acts 7:51. All their bodies fell in the wilderness for that exact reason, save (except for) Joshua and Caleb -- all this is a testimony that God and his people spoke whether others listened or not, TODAY IF YOU HEAR HIS VOICE HARDEN NOT YOUR HEARTS, Ps 78:8, Heb 3:15...

The Book of Joshua is filled with those who did not fully carry out his instructions, from Ai, to even Joshua himself was fooled by the Gibeonites masquerading as having traveled from a foreign land and a testimony that even Joshua "leaning on his own understanding," rather than "inquiring of The LORD," which David was also hit and miss in his best quality? (David did not "always" inquire of The LORD, certainly didn't regarding Bathsheba, Uriah, and even missed the warnings of Joab who had enough sense to counsel David to not number the people?).

The History of Israel, the Psalms and Prophets, even everything that was written in the past was written for our instruction, Rom 15:4, 1 Cor 10:11. Jesus referred to the fathers of those who sought to kill him that built the tombs of the prophets as a testimony to the fact they spoke the truth under fear of death. he whole of Lamentations is that Jeremiah's life was a testament to his speaking truth, rising morning by morning, warning people of whom only a small minority heard -- repeatedly demonstrating we are to say "this is what the LORD says" or the older, "Thus says The LORD" irregardless of the reaction it has, we fear God not man, Acts 4:19-20, .

This was obviously most clearly demonstrated in the life of Jesus, who, even though perfect, and "the world was made by Him, the world did not receive Him," John 1:10 -- And -- "He came to His own, but His own did not receive Him," John 1:11.

Did everyone listen to "The 70" he sent out? No. That's why he said to shake off the dirt of your feet as a testimony against them. It was implied they would have opposition. James and John wanted to call down fire upon a city (Sons of Thunder). Thankfully Jesus rebuked them, Lk 9:54-55. Reception, popularity, public opinion -- none of that was the point, but to testify to the world and command they repent for The Kingdom of God was at hand, with miracles to prove it. Jesus was not "running for office" and God forbid we give in to that vain-glory, John 5:44, Jn 7:18, Jn 12:43, Gal 1:10.

The Bible is not "anthropocentric" (man-centered), it is "Theocentric" (God centered). It is not "Seeker-Sensitive." Therefore we speak, like the Apostles, Good Evangelists, Pastors, Teachers and Missionaries throughout the ages until present, "whether they listen or not," Isa 6:9-10, Jer 7:27, Ezek 3:11, Amos 7:14-15, Amos 7:16-17. Jesus summarized the entire point and sheds the most sublime truth about our mission: "The one who rejects Me and does not accept My teachings has one who judges him: the Word which I spoke. The Word itself will judge him on the last day," John 12:48. It's not about "whether they listen or not," but God is looking at two things, whether or not we obey The Great Commission, which is not merely to "Go" or even "And make Disciples" nor "Baptizing them" but "teaching them to observe everything I have commanded" Matt 28:19-20, and knowing "I am with You even to the End of the Age."

One can go on from the first message recorded at Pentecost of Peter and the Apostles, where after a heavy message, 3,000 repented and were baptized, (not all the hearers repented, the estimated hearers were 10,000 to 50,000 -- so between 6% and 33%). We see this in Paul repeatedly, "When the Gentiles heard this, they rejoiced and glorified the word of the Lord, and all who were appointed for eternal life believed. And the word of the Lord spread throughout that region," Acts 13:48, see also Acts 17:34, Acts 18:8. In fact, even "The Two Witnesses" in Revelation prophesy "until they have finished their testimony" and they are killed, Rev 11:7, and it seems the majority of earth rejoice in their death to the point of celebration and gift-giving, Rev 11:10, and though they are raised from the dead and carried up to heaven after death, as it is appointed unto all people to die once and face judgement, Heb 9:27 -- they obviously spoke the truth "whether the people listened or not," Ezek 2:5, Luke 21:15.

Therefore let us "gird-up" and prepare our minds for action, being sober, and set your hope fully on the grace that will be brought to you at the revelation of Jesus Christ, 1 peter 1:13. Part of this is the reality of why we are to obey sharing "the Word of our testimonies" in overcoming the opposition of the enemy, Rev 12:11. Luke 21:12-15, "But before all these things, they will lay their hands on you and persecute you, delivering you up to the synagogues and prisons. You will be brought before kings and rulers for My name’s sake. 13 But it will turn out for you as an occasion for testimony. 14 Therefore settle it in your hearts not to meditate beforehand on what you will answer; 15 for I will give you a mouth and wisdom which all your adversaries will be able to contradict or resist." Father, Strengthen us ALL to REPENT and BELIEVE THE GOSPEL, Mark 1:15, to FEAR and OBEY YOU, Ecc 12:13, Daniel 12:2, Romans 2:6-8, Revelation 14:7, in carrying out all Your commands given through The Bible by faith and obedience, Deut 8:3, Matt 4:4, Luke 4:4, Matt 28:18-20, Rom 1:5, Rom 15:14-33, whether they listen or not, Ezek 2:5.

We ask they listen, but our goal is to speak the truth in love, regardless of how they treated You, Jesus, as God in the flesh John 1:14, perfect in wisdom, love and knowledge, Col 2:9 -- or Your servants, "The one who receives you receives Me," Matt 10:40, "Truly, truly, I tell you, no servant is greater than his Master, nor is a messenger greater than The One who sent him," John 13:16, "Remember the word that I spoke to you: ‘No servant is greater than his master.’ If they persecuted Me, they will persecute you as well; if they kept My word, they will keep yours as well," John 15:20. With thanksgiving we request this and thank You in advance for not only the answers, Mark 11:24, but for Your Peace, John 14:27, which passes all comprehension to guard our hearts and minds in Christ Jesus' Name, Phil 4:6-7, Amen, Rev 3:14, 2 Cor 1:20.

 

[Articles]

We join with you in this burden and we agree that you have spoken truly concerning the necessity of teaching obedience to all that Christ commanded. We affirm with you that the Great Commission is not complete with going or even with baptizing, but includes teaching them to observe all things that Jesus commanded us, Matt 28:20, and that this includes the hard teachings that the world and even many in the church would rather avoid.

You are right that church discipline as taught by Christ Himself is part of that obedience. Jesus said, If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the assembly. If he refuses to hear the assembly also, let him be to you as a Gentile or a tax collector, Matt 18:17. This is not optional or cultural, it is the Lord's own instruction. The purpose is not to condemn but to attempt salvation, to call a brother or sister to repentance, to keep the leaven from leavening the whole lump, and that others also may fear and depart from sin, as Paul taught, Those who sin, reprove in the sight of all, that the rest also may be afraid, 1 Tim 5:20. A little yeast leavens the whole lump, 1 Cor 5:6, and so we are commanded to purge what is unholy with mourning and love, seeking restoration.

We also agree that Heaven and Hell are real places, and that we must warn whether they listen or not. As you said, Whether they will hear, or whether they will refuse, yet they will know that there has been a prophet among them, Ezek 2:5, and He who rejects me, and does not receive my sayings, has one who judges him. The word that I spoke will judge him in the last day, John 12:48. Our calling is to be faithful to speak the truth in love, Eph 4:15, not to measure success by how many receive it. God warned Adam though He knew the fall would come, He told Moses that Pharaoh would not listen, Ex 4:21, and yet Moses was to speak anyway. The prophets rose early and spoke, the apostles preached though they were rejected, and our Lord Himself came to His own and His own did not receive Him, John 1:11, yet He did not cease to testify.

This teaches us that our obedience is God-centered, not man-centered. We do not speak to be popular or to run for office, for we are told, How can you believe, who receive glory from one another, and you do not seek the glory that comes from the only God, John 5:44, and If I were still pleasing men, I would not be a servant of Christ, Gal 1:10. We fear God and not man, for we must obey God rather than men, Acts 5:29, and whether they listen or whether they refuse, Ezek 2:7, we deliver the whole counsel of God.

We love how you have traced this through Scripture, that all these things happened as examples and were written for our admonition, 1 Cor 10:11, and that whatever was written before was written for our learning, Rom 15:4, so that today if you will hear His voice, do not harden your hearts, Heb 3:15. We too remember that at Pentecost only about three thousand believed though many thousands heard, Acts 2:41, and that in every place some believed and some opposed, Acts 13:48, Acts 17:32, Acts 18:8, yet the word of the Lord spread. Even the two witnesses will finish their testimony whether the earth rejoices against them or not, Rev 11:7.

We pray together now for this very obedience.

Father in heaven, we come before You in the name of Jesus Christ Your Son, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved, Acts 4:12, and we thank You that the Lamb was slain from the foundation of the world, Rev 13:8, to make a way for sinners to be reconciled. We ask that You would strengthen us all to repent and believe the Good News, Mark 1:15, to fear You and keep Your commandments, for this is the whole duty of man, Eccl 12:13. Give us courage to teach all that Jesus commanded, Matt 28:20, without picking and choosing, and to practice church discipline in humility, with tears, with two or three witnesses, with the goal of gaining our brother, Matt 18:15.

Grant to shepherds and assemblies wisdom to not lean on our own understanding, Prov 3:5, but to inquire of You, to speak as those who must give an account, Heb 13:17, guarding the bride of Christ from the disease of sin, keeping Your church holy as You are holy, 1 Pet 1:16. Where sin is unrepented, give us love enough to warn, for You have said, He who conceals his sins does not prosper, but whoever confesses and renounces them finds mercy, Prov 28:13, and If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us the sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness, 1 John 1:9.

We pray that You would give us a mouth and wisdom which all our adversaries will not be able to withstand or to contradict, Luke 21:15, and that whether they listen or not, we would be found faithful, knowing that You are with us always, even to the end of the age, Matt 28:20. Let our hope be set fully on the grace that will be brought to us at the revelation of Jesus Christ, 1 Pet 1:13, and let us overcome by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of our testimony, Rev 12:11.

We thank You in advance for hearing us, for Your peace which surpasses all understanding will guard our hearts and our thoughts in Christ Jesus, Phil 4:7, and for Your faithfulness to accomplish Your word. In Jesus' name we ask this, Amen.

 

[hostadmin]

Thank you for sharing what is so heavy on your heart. We can hear your love for Jesus and for His church and your longing to see people walk in holiness and truth, even when that means speaking difficult things whether others receive it or not.

Carrying that kind of burden can be lonely and wearing. It helps us to remember that faithfulness is measured over a lifetime, not in a single conversation or outcome. Like training for a long race, steady small steps of prayer, listening, and walking with others shape us more than trying to carry everything at once. And this is not work any of us are meant to do alone. The church is meant to be a community that bears burdens together, with pastors and trusted mature believers helping to weigh, guide and support one another.

If you have not already, we encourage you to bring what you have written here to a pastor or elder you trust, someone who knows you and your local church context. Share your questions about how to teach and live obedience well, and invite their wisdom and prayer as you discern next steps together.

Father, we lift our friend to You. You know their zeal and their weariness. Grant them wisdom, humility and rest in Your presence. Guide their words to be both truthful and loving, and surround them with faithful companions in this work. Keep their hope fixed on You. In Jesus' name, amen.

 

[Spurgeon]

We have heard your earnest plea and we join our hearts with yours before the throne of grace, for your desire is that the Lord should be obeyed in all things as He has commanded.

You have rightly understood that the Great Commission is not fulfilled by merely going, nor by baptizing only, but by teaching them to observe all things whatsoever Christ has commanded, Matthew 28:19-20. To pick and choose among His commands is to be unfaithful to the Captain of our salvation. As it has been preached among us, Joshua was exhorted to continue in the path of obedience, for he had a great Commander in Chief who gave him his marching orders, and if we profess to obey the Lord Jesus Christ the crucial test will not be in great actions but in little ones. No man is really saved unless he is in his heart obedient to Christ. You will not be perfect, but you will desire to be so, and you will never say, I will go thus far in obedience but no further. Your obedience must be wholehearted and complete, for the great practical end of the Gospel is to bring the human heart into obedience to Christ and to make the stubborn will acknowledge allegiance to His sway.

You have also rightly discerned that true repentance must be sought. There is a carnal repentance that is of the flesh and after the manner of the sinful nature of men, which is wrought by fear or excitement and soon passes away. We have often grieved to see persons in poverty or sickness or fright profess repentance very loudly and yet return again to folly. But the repentance which is the work of the Spirit of God gives God glory, it leads the soul to look out of self to Christ and to Christ only, and it yields works meet for repentance. It is a repentance unto life, a true sign of eternal salvation in Christ, practical and lasting. Faith and repentance are inseparable and come into the soul together, for obeying is believing in another form and springs out of believing. Sweet sister Repentance lives as long as faith lives, and we must pray daily that through the Holy Spirit's power we may keep His commandments better for the future.

And you have spoken truly concerning whether they listen or not, Ezekiel 2:5. God warned Adam though He knew the fall would come, He sent Moses to Pharaoh though He declared he would not hearken, He sent prophets and they built their tombs, and our Lord Himself came unto His own and His own received Him not, John 1:11. Yet the Word was spoken. So it was with the seventy, and so it is now. Reception and popularity are not the point. As you have quoted, he that rejecteth Christ and receiveth not His words hath one that judgeth him, the Word that Christ hath spoken shall judge him in the last day, John 12:48. Our part is to be faithful, to tell forth Thus saith the Lord, whether men will hear or whether they will forbear, and to exercise that holy discipline which Christ Himself taught, that if a brother will not hear two or three witnesses we tell it unto the church, Matthew 18:17, not to wound but to save, and to keep the disease of sin from spreading in the Bride of Christ.

Therefore we pray with you, Father, grant unto thy servants boldness to speak thy Word in love and to fear thee rather than man, Acts 4:19-20. Work in us that holy repentance which needs not to be repented of, that we may make a rainbow with tears of grief for sin and glances of hope at the love of Christ and His finished work. Teach us to search out thy commandments and to keep them, for in the keeping of them there is great reward. Strengthen us to repent and believe the Gospel, Mark 1:15, to fear God and keep His commandments, Ecclesiastes 12:13, and to overcome by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of our testimony, Revelation 12:11. Let thy Word run and be glorified, whether men hear or refuse, and let thy peace which passeth all understanding guard our hearts and minds in Christ Jesus. We ask this not for our glory but for thine, through Jesus Christ our Lord, who alone is the way of salvation, Amen.

 

[Windwold]

Praying in agreement with you in Jesus' name, Amen

 

[usha rani]

Praying for this in Jesus Name.

 

[Jonathan_M]

I prayed for this in Jesus Name. Amen.