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<blockquote data-quote="Newbie" data-source="post: 28483162" data-attributes="member: 735830"><p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px">31 minutes ago, Intercessor said:</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"><strong>Anon:</strong> What about those who remain loyal to God? Will they be made perfect. The Bible says, "He will make all things new." (Revelation 21:5) Does that mean they will be without sin? Will they become perfect as God is perfect?</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"><strong>Newbie:</strong> No. We are not God, only He is perfect. We will continue to make mistakes, because that is how we grow. I do not believe that once we go to heaven we will be as perfect as God. We are all sinners and make mistakes, and I think that we will continue to so so in the next life.</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px">Sorry, this is not true. The very definition of heaven is that it is a place of perfection.</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px">1) If we were to sin in heaven, heaven would not be perfect anymore -- that's what started the whole initial rebellion (Isaiah 14, Ezek 28).</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px">2) The Bible teaches we will be like Jesus.</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px">a) Jesus said "it is enough for a student to become like his Master" (Matt 10:25, Luke 6:40). </p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px">b) Where we are never above Christ, "we do become like him" because of the Change brought about when we see Him face to face (1 John 3:1-3), "Behold what manner of love the Father has given to us, that we should be called children of God. And that is what we are! The reason the world does not know us is that it did not know Him. 2<a href="http://biblehub.com/greek/27.htm" target="_blank">Beloved,</a> <a href="http://biblehub.com/greek/1510.htm" target="_blank">we are</a> <a href="http://biblehub.com/greek/3568.htm" target="_blank">now</a> <a href="http://biblehub.com/greek/5043.htm" target="_blank">children</a> <a href="http://biblehub.com/greek/2316.htm" target="_blank">of God,</a> <a href="http://biblehub.com/greek/2532.htm" target="_blank">and</a> <u><a href="http://biblehub.com/greek/5101.htm" target="_blank">what</a> <a href="http://biblehub.com/greek/1510.htm" target="_blank">we will be</a> <a href="http://biblehub.com/greek/3768.htm" target="_blank">has not yet</a> <a href="http://biblehub.com/greek/5319.htm" target="_blank">been revealed.</a> <a href="http://biblehub.com/greek/1492.htm" target="_blank">We know</a> <a href="http://biblehub.com/greek/3754.htm" target="_blank">that</a> <a href="http://biblehub.com/greek/1437.htm" target="_blank">when</a> <a href="http://biblehub.com/greek/5319.htm" target="_blank">Christ appears,</a> <a href="http://biblehub.com/greek/1510.htm" target="_blank">we will be</a> <a href="http://biblehub.com/greek/3664.htm" target="_blank">like</a> <a href="http://biblehub.com/greek/846.htm" target="_blank">Him,</a> <a href="http://biblehub.com/greek/3754.htm" target="_blank">for</a> <a href="http://biblehub.com/greek/3708.htm" target="_blank">we will see</a> <a href="http://biblehub.com/greek/846.htm" target="_blank">Him</a> <a href="http://biblehub.com/greek/2531.htm" target="_blank">as</a> </u><a href="http://biblehub.com/greek/1510.htm" target="_blank"><u>He is</u>.</a> 3And everyone who has this hope in Him purifies himself, just as He is pure." Also Philippians 3:20-21 says we will be transformed by His power at the return of Christ to be like His glorious body... 20 But our citizenship is in heaven. And we eagerly await a Savior from there, the Lord Jesus Christ, 21 who, by the power that enables him to bring everything under his control, <u>will transform our lowly bodies so that they will be like his glorious body</u>.</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p> </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I never thought about it like that. I got my original answer from here:</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p> </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p><a href="https://christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/5966/will-we-be-perfect-in-heaven" target="_blank">https://christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/5966/will-we-be-perfect-in-heaven</a></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p> </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Second answer, which says:</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px">Quote</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px">Only God is perfect, and (except for Mormon teaching) we will never be God. Ergo, we will never be perfect.</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px">Going a bit deeper into the word, however, when the Bible uses the word perfect, it is typically the Greek word telos. Telos does not imply a state of being, but rather a direction toward the end for which a thing is made. It has the sense of a target, minus the actual arrival.</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Newbie, post: 28483162, member: 735830"] [INDENT] 31 minutes ago, Intercessor said: [B]Anon:[/B] What about those who remain loyal to God? Will they be made perfect. The Bible says, "He will make all things new." (Revelation 21:5) Does that mean they will be without sin? Will they become perfect as God is perfect? [B]Newbie:[/B] No. We are not God, only He is perfect. We will continue to make mistakes, because that is how we grow. I do not believe that once we go to heaven we will be as perfect as God. We are all sinners and make mistakes, and I think that we will continue to so so in the next life. Sorry, this is not true. The very definition of heaven is that it is a place of perfection. 1) If we were to sin in heaven, heaven would not be perfect anymore -- that's what started the whole initial rebellion (Isaiah 14, Ezek 28). 2) The Bible teaches we will be like Jesus. a) Jesus said "it is enough for a student to become like his Master" (Matt 10:25, Luke 6:40). b) Where we are never above Christ, "we do become like him" because of the Change brought about when we see Him face to face (1 John 3:1-3), "Behold what manner of love the Father has given to us, that we should be called children of God. And that is what we are! The reason the world does not know us is that it did not know Him. 2[URL='http://biblehub.com/greek/27.htm']Beloved,[/URL] [URL='http://biblehub.com/greek/1510.htm']we are[/URL] [URL='http://biblehub.com/greek/3568.htm']now[/URL] [URL='http://biblehub.com/greek/5043.htm']children[/URL] [URL='http://biblehub.com/greek/2316.htm']of God,[/URL] [URL='http://biblehub.com/greek/2532.htm']and[/URL] [U][URL='http://biblehub.com/greek/5101.htm']what[/URL] [URL='http://biblehub.com/greek/1510.htm']we will be[/URL] [URL='http://biblehub.com/greek/3768.htm']has not yet[/URL] [URL='http://biblehub.com/greek/5319.htm']been revealed.[/URL] [URL='http://biblehub.com/greek/1492.htm']We know[/URL] [URL='http://biblehub.com/greek/3754.htm']that[/URL] [URL='http://biblehub.com/greek/1437.htm']when[/URL] [URL='http://biblehub.com/greek/5319.htm']Christ appears,[/URL] [URL='http://biblehub.com/greek/1510.htm']we will be[/URL] [URL='http://biblehub.com/greek/3664.htm']like[/URL] [URL='http://biblehub.com/greek/846.htm']Him,[/URL] [URL='http://biblehub.com/greek/3754.htm']for[/URL] [URL='http://biblehub.com/greek/3708.htm']we will see[/URL] [URL='http://biblehub.com/greek/846.htm']Him[/URL] [URL='http://biblehub.com/greek/2531.htm']as[/URL] [/U][URL='http://biblehub.com/greek/1510.htm'][U]He is[/U].[/URL] 3And everyone who has this hope in Him purifies himself, just as He is pure." Also Philippians 3:20-21 says we will be transformed by His power at the return of Christ to be like His glorious body... 20 But our citizenship is in heaven. And we eagerly await a Savior from there, the Lord Jesus Christ, 21 who, by the power that enables him to bring everything under his control, [U]will transform our lowly bodies so that they will be like his glorious body[/U]. [/INDENT] I never thought about it like that. I got my original answer from here: [URL]https://christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/5966/will-we-be-perfect-in-heaven[/URL] Second answer, which says: [INDENT] Quote Only God is perfect, and (except for Mormon teaching) we will never be God. Ergo, we will never be perfect. Going a bit deeper into the word, however, when the Bible uses the word perfect, it is typically the Greek word telos. Telos does not imply a state of being, but rather a direction toward the end for which a thing is made. It has the sense of a target, minus the actual arrival. [/INDENT] [/QUOTE]
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